Bert Green on March 11, 2009, at 05:48PM – #1

I think this idea has some merit, but because it creates transfers for many riders who may travel beyond the Artesia or El Monte stations, there has to be some thought given to transfer time. If the new Silver Line (which I think they have dubbed the 910 bus) runs frequently enough and transfers are coordinated, it could be a good solution.

sittingthinker on March 12, 2009, at 09:27AM – #2

Bert, Your concerns regarding transfers are mirrored by the hundreds of comments Metro has received in the previous months regarding this new BRT line. Just a thought, if it was up to you, how would you implement the new line so it causes minimal disruption for riders?

cph on March 12, 2009, at 11:16AM – #3

Offer free transfers at El Monte and Artesia Station?

MTA has been pushing this idea at least since 1994. I'm not convinced that it is a good idea, mostly because I can't think of anyone who, say, lives in El Monte and works near the Artesia Station. Now, maybe an express bus from El Monte to Century City/Westwood, El Segundo, or even Torrance might have an audience. But this BRT routing seems to be more for the convenience of MTA, than for the needs of its passengers....

Dana Gabbard on March 12, 2009, at 11:27AM – #4

This is a bad idea. Downtown traffic guarantees it will bog down and run late for whichever facility it runs through after. This is being driven by the Fastlanes Metro is doing with federal funds doled out by transportation policy zealots in the waning days of the Bush administration. Need I say more.

Bert Green on March 12, 2009, at 03:18PM – #6

"if it was up to you, how would you implement the new line so it causes minimal disruption for riders?"

Good question. Two things: dedicated bus lanes on the streets it uses downtown, and enough frequency on the 910 Silver (say every ten minutes) so that transfers would be a non-issue for most riders.

The MTA is looking to create a through service which will function like the downtown connector would for the light rail lines. I am cautiously supportive of it.

TK on March 13, 2009, at 11:40PM – #7

First of all, the price would have to come in line with the rest of Metro. There have been a few occasions I've considered the Harbor Transitway, but I don't want to come up with however much in small change they need. Second, so that it actually feels like a transfer to a line instead of just an expensive bus, they should give the line ACTUAL stations through the new downtown part, such as with the Orange line. I remember when I first tried to take the Harbor Transitway bus and saw on the metro map that it had the same denotation as the orange line, I was quite miffed to find no such station (or even directions as to where to board) at 7th and Metro. Perhaps even have the bus come underground to the station??

Erik Griswold on March 14, 2009, at 12:02PM – #9

What would be even more awesome is if this bus ran through to the El Monte METROLINK station on its east end and to either Redondo Beach Green Line, or Artesia Blue Line on the south end. Would not add too much travel time as the distance is short in El Monte, and both rail stations have nearly direct routing via limited-access highway (a.k.a. "Freeway") on the south end.

Termination at rail stations builds ridership, especially when both the bus and the rail lines have frequent service.

P.S. "Freeways" are not actually free!

calwatch on March 15, 2009, at 01:18AM – #10

The original idea for the route actually split half of El Monte buses to go south to Carson and half the buses over to El Segundo (Aviation Green Line station). With this set up, there are going to be entirely too many buses on the Harbor Transitway side, with Torrance, Gardena, and the MTA 445, 450, and 550 still operating.

David R. Yale on May 05, 2009, at 04:20PM – #11

Don’t settle for Bus Rapid Transit! Light rail is far superior to BRT for several reasons:

1. Light rail vehicles are less expensive in the long run, with useful lives of 40 to 60 years. Reconditioned LRVs from the 1950s are still running in San Francisco and Philadelphia. Where do you see a 40 year old bus in regular service?

2. Light rail vehicles have better acceleration than buses do, and can run a route much faster than buses. This means that you need fewer LRVs and fewer drivers to cover the same route.

3. Light rail vehicles can run in much narrower lanes than buses can, so they take up less space. This is especially important in crowded urban areas.

4. Light rail vehicles only use energy when they are accelerating. When they decelerate, the momentum is turned back into electric energy. When they’re at rest, their motors use no energy at all. Most buses use energy continually, whether they are accelerating, decelerating, or standing still.

5. Light rail vehicles give a smoother, bump-free ride far superior to the bouncing around bus passengers are subject to.

6. Operating expenses for light rail vehicles is significantly less than for buses, according to the Federal Transit Administration's 2001 National Transit Database. Boston’s light rail line had costs of $1.25 per trip vs. $2.04 for buses. If you want the figures expressed as costs per passenger mile, Boston spent $0.51 for LRVs and $0.71 for buses.

For extensive information about the benefits of light rail, go to [link text] (http://www.lightrailnow.com).

– David R. Yale

Alex on December 02, 2009, at 01:08PM – #12

David, maybe you're not aware, but this is basically an existing pair of transitways that are being rebranded as a single BRT route. I'm all for light rail, but is not a "should we pick BRT or LRT" situation.

I, for one, am with Bert on this and am cautiously optimistic. I appreciate the simplicity of combining the Harbor Transitway and El Monte Transitway into an Orange Line-esque system. No more looking up which buses use which transitway. I also live right above the proposed Silver Line route (where the existing 4XX Express buses run) and would welcome the new (hopefully better maintained) buses that would eventually run on the line.

Sameer on December 03, 2009, at 10:03AM – #13

I agree with TK; Since Metro has had the Harbor and El Monte Transitways labeled like they label the Orange Line, they should treat this new consolidated line the same way they treat the Orange Line. There should be permanent stations constructed, and ample signage at rail stations to help transferring passengers find their way to the line above ground. I've always wondered why the Metro map would show the Harbor Transitway "sharing" Pico and 7th/Metro with the Blue Line, when I couldn't find even one indication at those stations where the Harbor TW buses would pick up.

And as Erik suggested, I definitely agree that the El Monte portion of the busway needs to connect the two major transit hubs in El Monte. It's ridiculous that there is a train at one station and all the long-distance buses at the other. This could be the conduit needed to coordinate the two stations.